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[News] Let's talk about Kavanaugh and modern feminism

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发表于 6-10-2018 15:40:44 | 显示全部楼层
1 in 2 women has experienced sexual harassment and only based on survey. Well we have very sophisticated law to deal with sexual harassment. There is nothing to prevent women from filing their complaints. I would rather look into the figures for how many case were filed, processed and men got charged for it other than relying on a survey to tell the true story. Same deal as the sexual violence. How many rape cases filed, how many rapist got verdict. Sorry honey, if there is something more objective in place that everyone can get to investigate by the same standard a survey mean nothing to me. This survey is just another perfect example how badly the hard left social justice movement has infiltrated in every level of the society to manipulate people's mind.

That's exactly why #MeToo campaign comes to existence to raise the public awareness, encourage women who suffered from this ordeal to speak up, to put message across to all women letting them know what resources that would be accessible to them and what backups they would have available if unfortunately they found themselves in this situation.
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发表于 6-10-2018 16:06:15 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 yping88 于 7-10-2018 09:17 编辑
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 11:38
Then I guess we have to agree to disagree. Anybody can talk dirty in totally private occasions.  ...


Being genuine and being disgraceful is completely different concept in politics, my dear!

Take for instance Mr Trump! He has been often behaving disgracefully around women and talking about women in a disparaging manner, that's disgusting behaviour under Genuineness' disguise!

Guess you remember how many times he lied whenever facing the sexual misconduct allegations against him; How many times he lied about how he built Trump business; how he lied about his camp's connections with Russia. In fact, there is an ongoing scrutiny that looks into how he dodged paying his due taxes and fulfill his citizen's tax-liability when he inherited the vast properties and estates from his father!

So, he is not genuine or honest at all! Don't you use that word on him loosely to devalue it, my dear friend!
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发表于 6-10-2018 16:28:01 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 yping88 于 6-10-2018 15:33 编辑
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 12:05
I'm honest I'm brave enough to be political incorrect to say male privilege is a bloody myth in We ...


I can only respond to this post by posting a fact that's in the statistics (Once again, you can question its credibility and authority).

Since #MeToo movement comes to existence in 2017, it has imposed enormous impact on the following countries:

Afganistan, Australia, Canada, Chile, China, Ethiopia, France, Germany, India, Israel, Palestinian Territories,
Italy, Japan, Kenya, Nigeria, Norway, Pakistan, Philippines, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, United Kingdom

So, it's not fair to say that feminine campaign only "wages the war against men in the West", they have done extremely well sending the message all across the world!

Plus,  I am not a big fun calling this campaign a war against men, because it's not a war. Its purpose and endpoint is reaching out to women in all walks of life, globally if it will, to raise the public awareness about the prevalence and magnitude of sexual harassment or violence against women, and how those issues have gone unspoken of due to whatever reasons or concerns!
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发表于 6-10-2018 16:35:53 | 显示全部楼层
My dear friend, I have to take a break now, because my hands almost became the claws doing what I have been doing today and being a keyboard worrier! Guess, you are the same!

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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 17:43:09 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 14:33
20% women have 'experienced' sexual 'violence'. Wording is everything isn't it? Is hearing of somebo ...

Here we go. Any narrative put out there by to promote 'social progressive' propaganda can't even be questioned. OK, let me be a bigot to do that.

Dear, how you define sexual violence or harassment or experience is only your opinion. Again you are an individual only. Nobody can represent other people's opinion. So who on earth can be sure everyone stick to the same standard and all be genuine when they ticked the box for that survey? Because it was women who answered the questionnaire so I have to believe it? Even it completely contradict with official data based on objective standard and GENUINE CASES?? No wonder what happened to Kavanaugh. Same kind of logic everywhere.
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 17:51:48 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 14:40
1 in 2 women has experienced sexual harassment and only based on survey. Well we have very sophistic ...

I can agree that #metoo did encourage some women to speak up. But if the real situation is so bad and the #metoo have been there for a few years have we seen a sharp hike of filing of sexual harassment complaint, not necessarily need to get close to that 50% ratio at least make that look a bit more convincing? No, not even close. Nothing has significantly changed except the noise of screaming in the protests and the further strengthened victimhood sentiment.
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 17:56:40 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 牧马人 于 6-10-2018 19:30 编辑
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 15:28
I can only respond to this post by posting a fact that's in the statistics (Once again, you can  ...


#metoo has imposed enormous impact on Afganistan, Pakistan, Nigeria, Philippines? Oh dear, you can't be serious. Oh China happened to be in that list as well. Well I just happen to know China. Enormous? The word I would use is little.

No further comments on this unless I see any solid evidence. I know there isn't. #metoo can not only create men's guilt from thin air it can also create its achievement from thin air as well.
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 18:23:32 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 牧马人 于 6-10-2018 19:31 编辑
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 15:06
Being genuine and being disgraceful is completely different concept in politics, my dear!

Take ...


What can I say. It's your rights to call that disgraceful. I would rather be friend with a genuine disgraceful man than a hypocrite.

Alright let's talk more about Trump. What 'disgraceful' thing did he say about women except 'grab by the p***y'? To be honest I can't think of any. He likes to make comments even mockeries sometimes about PEOPLE and of course some of them would be women. But please bear in mind it's a huge different between mocking someone who happened to be a women and mocking someone because she is a women.

Why do anybody think women should be exempt from mockery? Nobody should be, including women. Again the modern feminism isn't about equal rights. It's about privilege over men. Mocking men is fine. Call men morons and pigs is fine but how dare you mock a woman! I don't call mockery disgraceful. I say the tactic to impose collective victimhood onto all women is VERY disgraceful. Because the one who got mocked was a woman so every woman should feel offended? Come on.

And sexual 'misconduct', oh dear, another perfect example of the beauty of wording art. What is misconduct exactly except raping and harassment? Any law case went through and verdict against him was reached? Must keep it ambiguous again! Since the climate change sneakily replace global warming I have seen so much contribution the leftwing movement has done to English wording.
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 18:23:38 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 15:06
Being genuine and being disgraceful is completely different concept in politics, my dear!

Take ...

What can I say. It's your rights to call that disgraceful. I would rather be friend with a genuine disgraceful man than a hypocrite.

Alright let's talk more about Trump. What 'disgraceful' thing did he say about women except 'grab by the p***y'? To be honest I can't think of any. He likes to make comments even mockeries sometimes about PEOPLE and of course some of them would be women. But pleas bear in mind it's a hug different between mocking someone who happened to be a women and mocking someone because she is a women.

Why do anybody think women should be exempt from mockery? Nobody should be, including women. Again the modern feminism isn't about equal rights. It's about privilege over men. Mocking men is fine. Call men morons and pigs is fine but how dare you mock a woman! I don't call mockery disgraceful. I say the tactic to impose collective victimhood onto all women is VERY disgraceful. Because the one who got mocked was a woman so every woman should feel offended? Come on.

And sexual 'misconduct', oh dear, another perfect example of the beauty of wording art. What is misconduct exactly except raping and harassment? Any law case went through and verdict against him was reached? Must keep it ambiguous again! Since the climate change sneakily replace global warming I have seen so much contribution the leftwing movement has done to English wording.
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发表于 6-10-2018 20:26:23 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 yping88 于 6-10-2018 20:48 编辑
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 16:43
Here we go. Any narrative put out there by to promote 'social progressive' propaganda can't even b ...


Bravo, mate!

You have the balls to challenge ABS data and women's faith in ticking the boxes in the questionnaire forms!

If possible, you should rerun the polls every year against ABS ones and carefully enlist the women who can participate the survey!

So, we, as the general public, can access the GENUINE data and get PERSPECTIVE about the outcome of the survey!

Hey, bro, I only mean it in the argumentative perspective, there is no way or out of any of my intentions to be cynical about what I just said.

Hope you continue to be a good sport! I appreciate the way we discuss things through!

Thank you, my dear friend!

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发表于 6-10-2018 20:39:25 | 显示全部楼层
Nothing has significantly changed except the noise of screaming in the protests and the further strengthened victimhood sentiment.

We can look at this from a different angle recommending that #MeToo campaign should have done more to it a household accountability letting their boys grow up acknowledging women matter. Instead of sending their mother, aunties, cousins, nieces and sisters out screaming, protesting and alleging their victimhood, they should make their female family members and significant others feel safe and secure about their identities!
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发表于 6-10-2018 20:44:54 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 16:56
#metoo has imposed enormous impact on Afganistan, Pakistan, Nigeria, Philippines? Oh dear, you c ...

Ok, my unfortunate choice of word to generalize all the countries listed. So, I would go for "some degree of impact" in some countries depending on what social context it would be!

Playing word game, bro! Way to go!  
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发表于 6-10-2018 20:56:48 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 17:23
What can I say. It's your rights to call that disgraceful. I would rather be friend with a genui ...

Good argument, bro! You are right that women is no exception when it comes to mockery, everybody should be a good sport at the good, innocent jokes in the social context, if they are seeking gender equality!

However, Donald Trump or any other men of his kind should be isolated from those innocent mockeries. Please read this article if interested, you may find some answers to the questions you raised.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/07/ ... n-ghitis/index.html
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 20:57:00 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 19:39
Nothing has significantly changed except the noise of screaming in the protests and the further str ...

I thought we should stop teaching boys to be boys but take all children gender neutral as per the latest left ideology. So if I were really to follow that I would find it really difficult to get all the aspects reconcile.

#Metoo can get boys know women better? Hmmm, I would rather teach boys to be gentlemen (oops I just happen to be political incorrect again. Gentlemen? That's  disgusting masculinity sexism) to respect women, to protect women. Or should I teach boys as the #Metoo has been doing, hey son, don't rape alright?
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 21:01:14 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 19:44
Ok, my unfortunate choice of word to generalize all the countries listed. So, I would go for "some ...

I assumed that was not your wording but just quote from something from the internet. Let me put it this way. For those countries I questioned the impact is 0 except for China it is little. Please change my mind.
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发表于 6-10-2018 21:09:54 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 19:57
I thought we should stop teaching boys to be boys but take all children gender neutral as per the  ...

As matter of fact, boys don't have to be brought up according to any ideology, but to common sense and integrity. As a legal guardian who is accountable for what their boys could potentially turn out to be, you only need to let them know how heavy the weight could be having something disgraceful and unbearable inflicted on their loved ones or significant others against their will.
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发表于 6-10-2018 21:20:53 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 20:01
I assumed that was not your wording but just quote from something from the internet. Let me put it ...

I don't have to change your mind, likewise, you don't have to change mine! We could just agree the disagree, remember? There is nothing wrong that everybody would have some perspectives of their own on certain issue.

That's the whole idea freedom of speech is all about!

About the impact #MeToo campaign brings on those countries, I can't provide my personal experiences at all, because that's not possible for me to go seeking answers over there. All the resources I could rely on is statistics accessible to me, or from friends who happen to live somewhere.

Sad truth is that I don't have the balls like you do to challenge them!
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 21:23:56 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 20:09
As matter of fact, boys don't have to be brought up according to any ideology, but to common sense ...

As matter of fact, boys don't have to be brought up according to any ideology.

Good to see you are not that left. I knew from the beginning that's why we can have a real conversation. But do we really need #Metoo to teach us common sense and integrity? I don't. And thanks to the Kavanaugh case people get a chance to see what #Metoo is really up to. Punish a man for accusation w/o any corroboration. That is exactly the opposite of common sense and integrity.
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 21:26:12 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 20:20
I don't have to change your mind, likewise, you don't have to change mine! We could just agree the ...

Then please show me some stats. If it really makes some sense I may change my mind. In fact I change my mind all the time including some fundamental changes.
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发表于 6-10-2018 21:32:46 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 20:23
As matter of fact, boys don't have to be brought up according to any ideology.

Good to see you  ...

In my opinion, Kavanaugh's case is not only about #MeToo campaign, not what he really did or did not either! It's more about whether he really has the essential qualifications required from him: Supreme Court Judge's temperament, integrity, capability to face any crisis, impartiality in political stance, clear conscience to make the toughest calls in America's judicial world!
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发表于 6-10-2018 21:43:56 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 20:23
As matter of fact, boys don't have to be brought up according to any ideology.

Good to see you  ...

To drag this argument on, I should maintain that the key accounts Christine brought up against him did stand corroboration. Such as the date of the incident correlated with Kavanaugh's yearbook entry, the key witnesses she provided did turn up for their brewsky catch-up, Christine confided and identified Kavanaugh to her husband as her attacker years before Kavanaugh was promoted to DC judicial circle, a key witness both  sides identified refused to testify.
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 21:49:24 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 牧马人 于 6-10-2018 20:51 编辑
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 20:32
In my opinion, Kavanaugh's case is not only about #MeToo campaign, not what he really did or did n ...


Fair enough. If the protest was not about a dodgy accusation but about him being a conservative then I would have no problem whatsoever at the first place. But no. The #Metoo didn't want to stop at protesting him for being conservative. They wanted to do whatever they could to smear him, to ruin him, to bully the senators who voted for him even. They have done a really good job at showing their own true colour.

And those qualification, temperament, integrity, capability to face any crisis, can we find anything wrong in regards to these? I can't. The tricky things are here, impartiality in political stance. It's tricky because impartiality doesn't exist when it comes to political stance. It's tricky because people like to attack a stance for being partial because the stance doesn't align with theirs, especially the far left, oh they just love to do it. Another beauty is the clear conscience. Who to define what is conscience? In many cases who scream louder and push harder get to do that.
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发表于 6-10-2018 21:56:17 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 20:26
Then please show me some stats. If it really makes some sense I may change my mind. In fact I chan ...

Even about the credibility and authority of the bureau that conducts the survey and brings up the statistics, everyone has their own opinions. You have already challenged ABS' statistics, so, I recommend you to single out the ones that you trust the most and get a real sense how serious #MeToo campaign should get.

Then, you can show what you find and change my perspective! I am very easy to swing!
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发表于 6-10-2018 22:05:37 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 yping88 于 7-10-2018 09:13 编辑

And those qualification, temperament, integrity, capability to face any crisis, can we find anything wrong in regards to these? I can't. The tricky things are here, impartiality in political stance. It's tricky because impartiality doesn't exist when it comes to political stance. It's tricky because people like to attack a stance for being partial because the stance doesn't align with theirs, especially the far left, oh they just love to do it. Another beauty is the clear conscience. Who to define what is conscience? In many cases who scream louder and push harder get to do that.

That is why out of countless brilliant judges, only a few can be qualified to sit in the high chair in supreme court as a judge to navigate through and our of America's judicial dilemma in which there is no winning voice. To scare democrats out of their shell, that position is supposed to be permanent.
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发表于 6-10-2018 22:14:32 | 显示全部楼层
Fair enough. If the protest was not about a dodgy accusation but about him being a conservative then I would have no problem whatsoever at the first place. But no. The #Metoo didn't want to stop at protesting him for being conservative. They wanted to do whatever they could to smear him, to ruin him, to bully the senators who voted for him even. They have done a really good job at showing their own true colour.

That's why in the very beginning, I said the lowest level in politics is yet to come!

But, what democrats has achieved though in all this is that they get to expose how Trump's nominee behaves while facing the challenges, how he owes up to what he did in the past or how he deals with the adversities when "wrongly accused"(I have to quote this because I believe what's said happened really happened).
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 22:16:37 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 牧马人 于 6-10-2018 21:43 编辑
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 20:56
Even about the credibility and authority of the bureau that conducts the survey and brings up the  ...


I was asking for stats that can show what impact #Metoo had made to countries like Afghanistan, not something like the ABS survey.

As for the real situation for sexual violence and harassment there is already stats from the Australian police department, based on objective standards and real cases so no survey would mean anything to me.

Here comes a different perspective
The number of rape cases in 2010 is 6,378. Given that men and boys can also get raped but less likely so I reckon it's fair to assume 5,500 cases were against women. If this rate keeps for 100 years and all victims only to be victim once then the total number of raped women is 550,000.  That's only 4.4% of all the living women in Australia. Please note I counted for 100 years! Given that most victims only got raped between 15 to 45, 100 years means 3 complete generations.  So the real ratio is 1.5%. Screw the 1/3. That's purely BS

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发表于 6-10-2018 22:29:07 | 显示全部楼层
牧马人 发表于 6-10-2018 21:16
I was asking for stats that can show what impact #Metoo had made to countries like Afghanistan, no ...

Fair enough!

You do realize that not all sexual misconduct cases make it to the police department, don't you? Otherwise, police department wouldn't have had any more resources to tackle any other more serious issues.

That's why #MeToo campaign gets to spread quickly far and wide, because it covers all sexual misconducts: harassment, sexual abuse, sexual violence. Out of these misconducts, single harassment won't necessarily make a reportable case, will it?

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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 22:37:31 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 21:29
Fair enough!

You do realize that not all sexual misconduct cases make it to the police departm ...

I do realize that. I also do realize no way that only 5% of the rape cases made it to the police department. Maths already in the post above.
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 楼主| 发表于 6-10-2018 22:38:16 | 显示全部楼层
yping88 发表于 6-10-2018 20:43
To drag this argument on, I should maintain that the key accounts Christine brought up against him ...

I'll spend some time on that.
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发表于 7-10-2018 09:12:36 | 显示全部楼层
Breaking News:

Kavanaugh has been confirmed to make a judge in Supreme Court by the vote 50:48, with nearly half of senators voted lack of confidence in his qualification!

This outcome means that from now on out, the nation's most controversial disputes will be steered onto totally different direction: Abortion right, LGBT rights, the scope of presidential power (could be significantly compromised for Democrats president but unreasonably strengthen Republican president if Kavanaugh can't be impartial in his political stance) and the influence of religion on this society.


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