Interview: Peter Costello
PrintInterview: Peter Costello
November 18, 2007
Reporter : Laurie Oakes
Watch video: part one, Watch video: part two
Transcript
LAURIE OAKES: Mr, Costello, welcome to Sunday.
PETER COSTELLO: Thanks very much, Laurie.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, six days to go to the election. The polls say Labor to win, are you preparing for Opposition?
PETER COSTELLO: I'm preparing over the next six days to explain to the Australian people the nature of the choice. The choice, I think, is becoming clearer. It's between a government that has experienced economic management and has managed the economy to put more people in work than ever before and an untried and untested group of people who really aren't interested in the economy, who really haven't got the experience and don't have the policy and I think it's a very, very serious choice that people are going to face next Saturday and I want to do everything I can to explain to them the consequences of this choice.
LAURIE OAKES: Now you've had five weeks putting that case, it doesn't seem to have got through yet; at least people have not accepted it, why not?
PETER COSTELLO: Well I actually find as I move around Australia that the choice is becoming clearer and I find that, as we get closer to next Saturday, people are asking themselves this question, will you trust an untried team of Rudd, Gillard and Swan with your mortgage, your business, your job, your children's job or would you want to see Australia continue to be strong economically, and I find that choice is becoming clearer by the day.
Laurie, I thought it was very interesting this morning Mr Rudd said the first five things he would do if he became Prime Minister. None of them related to the economy, none of them related to tax, interest rates or jobs — a lot of stuff about what he would do on the international stage, Kyoto and Iraq. Nothing about what concerns mums and dads and what really worries them about their children's futures. I thought it was a very revealing interview that he gave this morning in the press.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, if he believes the economy's going well, why would he change anything if he assumed office?
PETER COSTELLO: Exactly right. Mr Rudd thinks it all runs itself. And he thinks that because he's never been part of the big economic debates in Australia. He thinks he can just slide along. He also had an extraordinary statement in one of the papers today that he thinks the future for people in Western Australia will be getting Chinese funds and investing them in real estate in Latin America. That's one of the things he's quoted as saying is the papers today. Who would want to invest money in Latin American real estate? And again I ? shows to me that he hasn't thought much about the economy. He hasn't been part of the big economic debates in Australia. He was never part of balancing the budget or paying off debt. He thinks that it all runs itself. What he wants to do is he wants to flit on the international stage, and when he's asked about the first five things that he would do, it's not about interest rates, it's not about mortgages or jobs or Australians, it's about Kyoto and Iraq and all of the things that he's really interested in and not the things that the public of Australia are really interested in.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, as I said, you had five weeks to argue your case, it hasn't got through yet, people are saying your campaign, the Government's campaign, has been a shambles. Was it a mistake for example, to announce a $9.5 billion spend-a-thon a couple of hours after the Reserve Bank's latest inflation warning?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, that campaign announcement was part of our carefully costed policies of $12 billion ?
LAURIE OAKES: Plus $34 billion in tax cuts?
PETER COSTELLO: Twelve billion dollars over and above the pre-election fiscal outlook and can I say, Laurie ?
LAURIE OAKES: Over and above the tax cut package which is the biggest election bribe ever offered?
PETER COSTELLO: Oh, no, I'll come back to that in a moment. Less spending than Mr Rudd. What Mr Rudd did is he spent $9 billion before his election launch and $3 billion at the launch. What the Coalition did was they spend $3 billion before and $9 billion at the launch, so let's actually add the figures together. It doesn't matter when you do it, it's $12 billion and in fact, the Coalition's spending in this election is less than Mr Rudd's. And let me make this point Laurie, because Mr Rudd's been saying for a very long period of time 'oh he's going to have $3 billion of savings'. Now, he had his chance last Thursday to put his $3 billion of savings in for costing and he didn't. That $3 billion, which he's been talking about since March of this year, was not submitted for costing last Thursday. He said he would. He didn't do it. He fell at the first hurdle, so that $3 billion has mysteriously evaporated as well, Laurie.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, have all your policies been submitted for costing?
PETER COSTELLO: Yes they have. We've submitted our policies — all of the policies that we've announced.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, for example, what about the proposal to have a board for every hospital in Australia? Has that been submitted for costing?
PETER COSTELLO: We've submitted our health policy and all of the funding in our health policy, Laurie, that's been submitted.
LAURIE OAKES: Did that include payment for board members?
PETER COSTELLO: Oh, Laurie. We spend $42 billion at the moment under our health care agreements. Can I say to you payments for board members is not a significant item of expenditure.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, $10,000 per board member, 10 person board for every hospital in Australia that's adding up into reasonable money isn't it?
PETER COSTELLO: Forty-two billion dollars in health care agreements, $50 billion a year, Laurie. Can I say to you, the expensive parts of the health system, of the Medicare system, the Pharmaceutical Benefits System, the Australian Health Care Agreements ?
LAURIE OAKES: What you're admitting is you haven't submitted it all?
PETER COSTELLO: I think you're clutching at straws, Laurie.
LAURIE OAKES: No, no there's a hole in your health policy to start with?
PETER COSTELLO: Laurie, come on.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, let me ask you this — there's a very good article in the Australian last Saturday week by David Uren.. He said the first duty of Treasury Secretary, Ken Henry, following the election should be to advise the victor to defer or shelve a large slice of their election promises? Now, if you get that advice from Ken Henry, if you win the election, will you shelve, or defer, promises?
PETER COSTELLO: No.
LAURIE OAKES: Why not?
PETER COSTELLO: Because all of the policies that I've put out in this election, together with John Howard, are carefully costed and at the end of them, we'll keep the budget in surplus and in surplus by one percent of GDP. One thing we know about this election is whoever wins this election Laurie, won't be inheriting $10 billion deficit or a $96 billion debt, as I did when I became Treasurer. You'll recall when Labor was last in office and it was voted out, the budget wasn't in surplus, it was $10 billion in the red.
LAURIE OAKES: I remember Bob Hawke said the same thing when he took over as well.
PETER COSTELLO: Yes, exactly right and the one thing ?
LAURIE OAKES: John Howard had been Treasurer ?
PETER COSTELLO: The one thing we know Laurie, is whoever wins, whether it's me or Mr Swan, that gets the figures on Monday, it won't be a $10 billion deficit, it will be more than a $10 billion surplus. There won't be $96 billion of debt. There will be no debt and there won't be unfunded liabilities because the future fund, now of $60 billion, is well on its way to funding them. So I can tell you this — the figures on the Monday, after the election, will be the figures that we've put out because they're true and they're accurate. And our policies will be implemented in full. What Mr Rudd does is anybody's guess. But I can tell you, our policies will be implemented in full.
LAURIE OAKES: Why was the Government so confident the Reserve Bank would not increase interest rates at its Melbourne Cup Day meeting and wasn't that a huge miscalculation in deciding the election date?
PETER COSTELLO: Laurie, let me say about official interest rates, which are lower today than they were when the Government was elected. And lower today in mortgage interest terms on a four percent unemployment rate than they were when we were in the deepest recession in 60 years, with unemployment in double figures. Now, official interest rates will move up and they'll move down. By the way, they've moved down more than they've moved up under the period that I've been Treasurer.
LAURIE OAKES: We have a poll in the papers today saying there's a sharp reaction against you in the mortgage built seats, so, it would suggest interest rates are an issue?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, I think interest rates are an issue, yes, of course they are and I would say to people, a mortgage interest rate of 8.5 percent, compared to, when I became Treasurer, 10.5 percent, even though unemployment has halved, it is a much better interest rate than you're likely to get under the Rudd-Swan-Gillard inexperienced team with bad policy. I think ?
LAURIE OAKES: You haven't said why you're so confident it wouldn't happen?
PETER COSTELLO: I think if Mr Rudd gets elected, if he gets elected next Saturday, I think people will look back, with fondness, on an 8.5 percent interest rate because just like we endured 17 percent, under Paul Keating, they'll wonder to themselves, how they ever got stuck with Rudd, Gillard and Swan managing their mortgage interest rates, their businesses and their jobs.
LAURIE OAKES: You're running in this election as a kind of alternative Prime Minister, the man who will take over from John Howard if the Coalition wins, you'll take over in mid-term. The Labor Party sees this as a disadvantage for the Coalition. How would a Costello Government differ from the Howard Government?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, the first thing I'd say, as somebody who's been part of the economic team for the last 11 years — obviously there will be continuity in economic policy, because I've been drafting and implementing the economic policies for the last 11 years. Over the course of those 11 years, we've had differences of view on some things. For example, we had differences of view in relation to the Republic and people know my view in relation to that. And, of course, I've had different issues that I've really wanted to focus on like inter-generational issues which I put on the map not only in Australia, but has now been taken up in many countries around the world. I want to actually look out over 10-20-30 and 40 years, now that we've repaired the damage of Labor, now to start investing for the future and I want to take a very, very long-term view of Australia and its possibilities.
LAURIE OAKES: Well, let's look at an issue of the future, climate change. You said, when you were on SBS News in May, the practical measures such as the Murray Darling plan and forest and solar initiatives were, 'Much better than coming out and announcing a target in 2050, when we know we'll all be dead anyway'. What did you mean by that?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, I mean that we've got to start working now. This idea, by the way ?
LAURIE OAKES: We'll all be dead anyway in 50 years, I mean, that wouldn't have impressed young voters who will hope to be alive by 2050.
PETER COSTELLO: Well Laurie, I hope to be alive in 2050.
LAURIE OAKES: So, what did you mean?
PETER COSTELLO: What I meant, was I'm not going to wait until 2050. I'm going to start working now. This idea by the way we can all sit around and it will fix itself in 2050, I think is mistaken. What we've got to start doing is we've got to start doing things now and practical things really count. That's why in this election campaign we've announced rebates for solar hot water systems. We already have rebates for solar electricity systems. We have rebates for water tanks. We have a $10 billion investment in the Murray Darling Basin. To sit round and say 'oh we'll do something in 2050' isn't the point here. The point is to start now.
LAURIE OAKES: You're also being portrayed as a bogey-man by the Labor Party on industrial relations, the man who, if you become Prime Minister would push WorkChoices further. You deny that but given your hard-line record, why do people believe the denial?
PETER COSTELLO: Well, because I've been part of this reform which has struck the right balance and I have no intention whatsoever of going further than the current situation. This situation I've been part of implementing.
LAURIE OAKES: Fixed in stone?
PETER COSTELLO: I don't want to change it, I want to keep it. I want to keep the fairness test because I think the fairness test has been a big part of flexibility — one, allowing people to get jobs. And two, fairness, allowing wages to increase. Can I say this Laurie, look at my record — I've been Treasurer now for a while ?
LAURIE OAKES: Yep.
PETER COSTELLO: Real wages under me have increased. They have increased. I want more jobs with higher wages. Now, compare that to the record of Labor, under Labor, not only did people go in to unemployment, but wages went down, down!
LAURIE OAKES: You have been a hard-liner on this, I mean, just to illustrate that is Council for the Australian Federation of Employers, in the 1987 National Wage case, you argued the minimum wage for a tradesman should be reduced from $305.10 to $171.30 a week so negotiations could then proceed flexibly on a company by company basis. Now, that's very radical, much more radical than anything in WorkChoices.
PETER COSTELLO: Well, I was a counsel for an employer body.
LAURIE OAKES: Julia Gillard was a counsel for union body and you said that should be taken in to account when people are considering what she'll do.
PETER COSTELLO: No, no, no, no.
LAURIE OAKES: You're a boss's lawyer.
PETER COSTELLO: No, no, what I was saying is that Julia Gillard was a member of the Socialist Forum.
LAURIE OAKES: No, no, she's a Labor lawyer in your ads. Are you saying you put that to the Industrial Relations Commission and ... didn't believe it?
PETER COSTELLO: No, no, let me go back two points. One is, I say Julia Gillard was a member of the Socialist Forum as an MP and would be an extremely left wing Deputy Prime Minister, yes, I say that. Secondly, what I also say as a counsel in various cases, I would have argued all sorts of things for both sides, incidentally, in 1987, which I think was 20 years ago. But, if you want to know what I think about industrial relations Laurie, have a look at my speeches in the Parliament; have a look at the laws that I've put in place. I'm actually proud of the fact that the changes in industrial relations have increased jobs by about 400,000. If you want to look at my record, it's there, I've been Treasurer for a decade. It's 20 percent increase in real wages. Why would you go past that?
LAURIE OAKES: Well, because the Liberals are trying to trot out what Julia said and did 20 years ago. 20 years ago, you argued in the Industrial Relations Commission that all award rates should be reduced to $171.30 a week, $25 below the lowest award then in existence and now you want people to believe that you're not radical on this and IR laws are set in stone if you become Prime Minister?
PETER COSTELLO: I've got no interest in what Julia Gillard did 20 years ago. My fear is what she would do as Deputy Prime Minister next Saturday. If you want to know what I think, about industrial relations Laurie, let me tell you. For 10 years now, I've presided over an economy in which 2.2 million new jobs have been created and wages have gone up 20 percent. I don't want to lower wages. I want higher wages but I know this, you can only increase wages and increase jobs if you increase productivity in the Australian economy. And I know this, that under an untried, inexperienced group of people who don't know how to manage an economy, all of that is at risk.
LAURIE OAKES: On that message, Mr Costello, we're out of time but thank you.
PETER COSTELLO: Thanks, Laurie.
回复 #1 衣冠禽兽 的帖子
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辛苦了！ 有空了慢慢看
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回复 #5 flyday 的帖子
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